Comments on: What's his accomplishment? That he's no longer an obnoxious drunk?

What's his accomplishment? That he's no longer an obnoxious drunk?

chunking express — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 11:44:46 -0800

Reagan's Son is Not Too Impressed. [An interesting Article from Salon, More Inside.]

By: chunking express

chunking express — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 11:49:50 -0800

Bush had this to say of Ronald Reagan during his eugooogly of the former president:

Ronald Reagan belongs to the ages now," Bush said, "but we preferred it when he belonged to us. [President Bush gives Reagan eulogy]

Creepy? A little bit perhaps. Now the Club for Growth, a conservative interest group, has unveiled a new ad that implies Bush and Reagan are cut from the same cloth. The former president's son would disagree with such a comparison:

But my father was a man—that's the difference between him and Bush. To paraphrase Jack Palance, my father crapped bigger ones than George Bush. [Regan Blasts Bush]

Reagan Jr. has been fairly vocal in his criticism of Bush:

What's his accomplishment? That he's no longer an obnoxious drunk? [Reaganite by Association? His Family Won't Allow It]

I wait patiently for the young Reagan's words to be turned into an advert as well—without his express permission of course.

"No one has requested the permission to use his image in an ad, nor would we feel it appropriate to give such permission at this juncture," Joanne Drake said. "We protect his image very carefully, particularly as it relates to politics."

By: chunking express

chunking express — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 11:50:56 -0800

Also, sorry for the Newsfilter Pain, but I thought all of this was interesting.

By: Mayor Curley

Mayor Curley — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:01:33 -0800

It definitely was. And to think that I laughed at the guy a few saturday mornings ago for doing dogshow commentary. He's awesome!

By: homunculus

homunculus — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:10:26 -0800

Enough With Reagan Already

By: jaded

jaded — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:11:33 -0800

Mayor Curley: Dogshow commentary appears to be what he does, now. All the time. Every dog show my SO has made me watch has had Reagan Junior as a commentator. He clearly loves it.

By: The God Complex

The God Complex — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:16:40 -0800

"The Bush people have no right to speak for my father, particularly because of the position he's in now," he said during a recent interview with Salon. "Yes, some of the current policies are an extension of the '80s. But the overall thrust of this administration is not my father's -- these people are overly reaching, overly aggressive, overly secretive, and just plain corrupt. I don't trust these people." As opposed to the Reagan administration, which was... overly reaching... overly aggressive... overly secretive.... and corrupt. Oh, and also Reagan seemed nicer. Ahem.

By: mr_roboto

mr_roboto — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:24:53 -0800

About the Reagan stuff: As of yesterday (I haven't walked around yet today; I expect I'll notice when I go to lunch) flags around here were still at half-mast. That seems like an awfully long time to keep the flags at half-mast, particularly since the man is already in the ground. Is there a generally accepted flag protocol for mourning the death of an ex-president?

By: PrinceValium

PrinceValium — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:35:22 -0800

mr_roboto: The flag shall be flown at half-staff 30 days from the death of the President or a former President; 10 days from the day of death of the Vice President, the Chief Justice or a retired Chief Justice of the United States, or the Speaker of the House of Representatives; from the day of death until interment of an Associate Justice of the Supreme Court, a Secretary of an executive or military department, a former Vice President, or the Governor of a State, territory, or possession; and on the day of death and the following day for a Member of Congress. 4 U.S.C. § 7(m).

By: jammer

jammer — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:37:30 -0800

Is there a generally accepted flag protocol for mourning the death of an ex-president? Yes. The flag code states 30 days for the death of a sitting or former president.

By: mr_roboto

mr_roboto — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:39:02 -0800

Hrm. I really should have been able to look that up myself. Sorry.

By: Succa

Succa — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 12:43:08 -0800

"And they told us, 'Don't worry about W. not knowing anything, good old Dick Cheney will be his minder.' Dick Cheney? And this was going to be compassionate conservatism? Dick Cheney is to the right of Genghis Khan, he wants to drill in your backyard, he wants to deny black people their rights --it was all there in his voting record for us to see. What were we, rubes?" Heh. Great read, thanks for sharing.

By: orange swan

orange swan — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 13:04:48 -0800

He's smart and he's right and he's honest - what was he, adopted?

By: amberglow

amberglow — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 13:07:39 -0800

nah...he's the closeted one ; >

By: jpoulos

jpoulos — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 13:23:53 -0800

The adopted one (Michael) is neither smart nor right nor honest. Ron's eulogy at the funeral last week was excellent. When he spoke about his father not wearing his religion on his sleeve, it was very likely a commentary on the current administration. Still, he managed to keep the moment from appearing a political attack.

By: jpoulos

jpoulos — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 13:28:40 -0800

The adopted one (Michael) is neither smart nor right nor honest. OK, that was off-the-cuff and inappropriate, since I really can't speak to Michael's intelligence or honesty. All I know about him is that he's an evangelical, and he strikes me as a bit tortured by his upbringing. A bit of a wackjob, IMO. But he may well be smart and honest.

By: chicobangs

chicobangs — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 13:34:40 -0800

Ron Junior does know how to conduct himself with a certain amount of clarity and decorum with the cameras running. But I'm thinking if the Bush camp can connect Saddam with Osama, then connecting the little guy to the Great Communicator should be a short bus ride in comparison. Still. Good on Ron for speaking out about this. I hope he gets heard. (And by comparison, when people start using John F. Kerry and John F. Kennedy in the same sentence, I get just as squicked out.)

By: orange swan

orange swan — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 13:35:46 -0800

nah...he's the closeted one ; > C'mon amberglow, you gotta leave us some good guys for the Het team.

By: fenriq

fenriq — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 15:58:30 -0800

Ron strikes me as a thoughtful and insightful man, quite unlike his slick poppa. And go read Mark Morford's column that homonculus links to above. It details some of Reagan's more notable "accomplishments" and why he should be reviled and not revered.

By: amberglow

amberglow — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 16:24:21 -0800

orange swan, i was amazed and delighted at Ron's remarks, and his remarks in the past. I even commented about them (whether Ron's truly a breeder is an open question, but you can have him if you guys are lacking decent folk--closet cases are too Drudge-esque for me anyway) In February of 1989, author Larry Kramer outed Reagan's son Ron on CNN's Larry King show. "The irony is Nancy's best friends are gay and their son Ron Reagan is gay - the essence is that Ronald Reagan and Nancy Reagan have sold their son down the river," Kramer said. "Ron Reagan could have been the biggest hero in the world if he had the courage to come forth and say he was gay, to shame and encourage his parents to do something about this epidemic, but because he didn't, more of us are dead." Confronted on his own TV show by outing inventor Michelangelo Signorile in 1991, Ron Reagan described himself as "straight." "It's [saying I'm gay] insulting to my wife of 11 years because it says she's living a lie, and I don't like that," Ron said. Signorile responded that he'd heard Ron's wife was a lesbian.- from Bay Windows

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 17:35:05 -0800

WTF makes that "outed"? He remains married and says he's straight... ...and so that makes him gay? Weird.

By: AstroGuy

AstroGuy — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:15:43 -0800

Ron's eulogy at the funeral last week was excellent. When he spoke about his father not wearing his religion on his sleeve, it was very likely a commentary on the current administration. His comments were most definitely a slam on the current administration: "Dad was also a deeply, unabashedly religious man. But he never made the fatal mistake of so many politicians wearing his faith on his sleeve to gain political advantage. True, after he was shot and nearly killed early in his presidency, he came to believe that God had spared him in order that he might do good. But he accepted that as a responsibility, not a mandate. And there is a profound difference."

By: amberglow

amberglow — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:18:45 -0800

fff, many men (but thankfully, fewer than there used to be) are married and gay, and say they're straight. Especially people from prominent families. Signorile has never outed a person falsely--he's always had proof.

By: five fresh fish

five fresh fish — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:44:55 -0800

Dunno, amberglow. Seems to me that until they publically admit or show their sexuality, they're not outed. Otherwise, I meet the same qualifications: male, married to female, says he's not gay. Maybe an "outing " FPP is in order, to educate me on the topic. 'cause now I'm kinda curious...

By: amberglow

amberglow — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 20:52:06 -0800

do you have sex with men? are men your preferred sexual partner? do you fall for men? fall in love with men? attracted to men? get a hardon/excited when you see a hot guy or a pic of one? Rock Hudson said he was straight and married women, for just one famous example. It's not complicated--it's called the closet.

By: delmoi

delmoi — Wed, 16 Jun 2004 23:37:20 -0800

How did his sexuality get called into question. Bizzare. OTOH, he does like dog shows.

By: litlnemo

litlnemo — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 01:09:57 -0800

Well, he used to be a ballet dancer. In some people's eyes that's enough to brand you as gay.

By: Satapher

Satapher — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 01:47:54 -0800

.02c * 26 = .02c

By: Goofyy

Goofyy — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 03:06:56 -0800

Ballet dancer, suddenly married to a woman, in a judge's chambers, after his father became POTUS. Quack quack.

By: chicobangs

chicobangs — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 05:15:04 -0800

I have a question. I mean this in all seriousness, and I would really like an answer from someone. So what? So fucking what if he's gay or straight or fucks chickens or table legs or a hole in a pine board? Does it detract from his credibility in your eyes if every aspect of his personal life is not beamingly on public view? It seems that that's part of the point Ron Junior was trying to make about Ron Senior, but maybe I'm just listening to too many nancyboys these days, eh? I should watch out. It might rub off.

By: amberglow

amberglow — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 05:36:12 -0800

chico, It was a derail by me--because orange swan asked if he was the adopted one, and i responded...i regret mentioning it now, since it became the focus. Sorry chunking. (and him being gay is not a bad thing at all--closeted is and was another story, especially when his father was ignoring an epidemic)

By: amberglow

amberglow — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 05:45:06 -0800

You could say tho, that Ron was saying his father kept his faith closeted, and that it was a good thing, which is psychologically interesting, if nothing else, since his statements while president often had religious undertones (altho not as much as Bush's, and he didn't implement policies to take public money and give it to religious orgs.) The "shining city on a hill" stuff is a good example, being Jerusalem.

By: chicobangs

chicobangs — Thu, 17 Jun 2004 06:48:56 -0800

I'm sorry, amberglow. I know it wasn't an intentional derail. (I posted before coffee this morning, which I should never do.) But your last point I think leads toward something else. I take that statement as a sign of Junior's own integrity, even within his own non-public life; that there were aspects of Dad's personality that were not for public consumption, but that clearly informed the decisions he made. Those words clearly ring true in his own life, regardless of what (or who) he does on his days off. As a son, he criticized his father for the right reasons, reasons of policy and professional conduct, not personally out of some visceral hatred. Like, say, I might.